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Top > Types of Music > Symphonies > Compositional Years and Ages of Schubertʼs Symphonies

This site introduces unknown composer Emanuel Bach (C. P. E. Bach). This English version was translated from Japanese one by ChatGPT.

Compositional Years and Ages of Schubertʼs Symphonies

I asked ChatGPT4o: "Please tell me the birth year of Schubert and the composition years of each of his symphonies."

Franz Schubert was born on January 31, 1797. Below are the composition years of his major symphonies.

Symphony No. 1 in D major, D 82

  • Composition year: 1813
  • Age at composition: 16 years old

Symphony No. 2 in B-flat major, D 125

  • Composition year: 1814 - 1815
  • Age at composition: 17 - 18 years old

Symphony No. 3 in D major, D 200

  • Composition year: 1815
  • Age at composition: 18 years old
Franz_Schubert_by_Wilhelm_August_Rieder_1875.jpg

Symphony No. 4 in C minor, D 417 “Tragic”

Symphony No. 5 in B-flat major, D 485

Symphony No. 6 in C major, D 589

Symphony in E major, D 729 (Unfinished) [Corrected]

Symphony No. 8 in B minor, D 759 “Unfinished” [Corrected]

Symphony No. 9 in C major, D 944 “The Great” [Corrected]

Symphony in D major, D 936A “Unfinished” [Corrected]

Schubert composed many symphonies from a young age, with the "Unfinished Symphony (No. 8)" being particularly famous. His symphonies evolved throughout his life, showcasing mature musical expression.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "It seems that many of Schubertʼs symphonies are unfinished. Did he intend to complete them?"

There are several unfinished works among Franz Schubertʼs symphonies, and whether he intended to complete them involves several factors and considerations.

  1. Creative Process and Health Condition

Schubert was a very prolific composer, but his health was not good. He died at the young age of 31 and suffered from illness (likely syphilis) in his later years. This may have left some of his works unfinished.

  1. Symphony No. 7 in E major, D 729

Schubertʼs Symphony No. 7 was partially composed, with detailed sketches remaining, but it was not fully orchestrated. It is unclear whether Schubert intended to complete this symphony, but the existence of the sketches indicates he was seriously working on it.

  1. Symphony No. 8 in B minor, D 759 “Unfinished”

Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished” has only two completed movements. This symphony is very famous, possessing deep musical expression and completeness despite being unfinished. It is unknown why Schubert did not complete this symphony, but it may have remained unfinished as he often moved on to new projects, focusing on other works.

  1. Symphony No. 10 in D major, D 936A

Symphony No. 10 is also unfinished and was discovered after Schubertʼs death. This work also has detailed sketches but is not in a complete form. Schubertʼs health condition and interest in other works may have influenced this.

Conclusion

There is no definitive answer as to whether Schubert intended to complete his unfinished symphonies, but his creative process, health condition, and interest in other projects are considered influential factors. Even in their unfinished state, his symphonies hold deep musical value and beauty, occupying an important place in music history.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "When were Schubertʼs symphonies discovered after his death?"

Regarding the symphonies discovered after Franz Schubertʼs death, the specific timing of their discovery is as follows.

Symphony No. 7 in E major, D 729

The sketches for this symphony were discovered after Schubertʼs death, but the exact year of discovery is unknown. However, these sketches were later studied by composers and musicologists, and attempts were made to complete them. Felix Weingartner completed and premiered this work in 1934.

Symphony No. 8 in B minor, D 759 “Unfinished”

Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished” was composed in 1822, with only two movements completed. This symphony was discovered and premiered by conductor Johann von Herbeck in 1865. This discovery made the “Unfinished Symphony” one of Schubertʼs most famous works.

Symphony No. 10 in D major, D 936A

The sketches for Symphony No. 10 were also discovered after Schubertʼs death, but the exact year of discovery is unknown. These sketches were studied by musicologists and composers in the 20th century, with attempts to complete them. A version completed by composer Brian Newbould in 1977 is known.

Symphony No. 9 in C major, D 944 “The Great”

Symphony No. 9 “The Great” was discovered after Schubertʼs death. Schubertʼs brother Ferdinand showed it to Robert Schumann in 1838, who recognized its value. It was subsequently premiered by the Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra conducted by Felix Mendelssohn in 1839.

These discoveries and premieres led to Schubertʼs symphonies becoming widely known after his death, further enhancing the appreciation of his musical legacy.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "Does this mean that all of Schubertʼs symphonies that are famous today were discovered after his death? Was Schubert not known as a symphony composer during his lifetime?"

It is true that Schubert was not widely known as a symphony composer during his lifetime. His symphonies became famous only after they were discovered and performed posthumously. Here are the reasons and circumstances for this.

Situation during his lifetime

  1. Reputation as a Lied Composer: During his lifetime, Schubert was highly regarded as a composer of Lieder (songs). He composed over 600 Lieder, which elevated his fame. However, his symphonies and other large-scale works were not well known during his lifetime.
  2. Lack of Performance Opportunities for Symphonies: Many of Schubertʼs symphonies had little opportunity to be performed during his lifetime. They were rarely featured in orchestral concerts, and his symphonies were not widely recognized.
  3. Publication Issues: Schubertʼs symphonies were hardly published during his lifetime. Many works only became widely known through publication, limiting the opportunity for his symphonies to be introduced to the public.

Posthumous Discovery and Evaluation

  1. Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished”: This symphony was discovered and premiered in 1865. The discovery of this work, in particular, heightened interest in Schubertʼs symphonies.
  2. Symphony No. 9 “The Great”: Discovered by Robert Schumann in 1838 and premiered by Felix Mendelssohn the following year, this symphony led to Schubertʼs symphonies becoming widely recognized.
  3. Discovery of Other Symphonies: In the 20th century, other symphonies by Schubert were discovered and performed, enhancing his reputation as a symphony composer.

Conclusion

During his lifetime, Schubert was primarily known as a Lied composer and not widely recognized as a symphony composer. However, after his death, the discovery and performance of his symphonies elevated his reputation as a symphony composer. Today, Schubertʼs symphonies are widely performed as an important part of the classical music repertoire.



I asked ChatGPT4o: “How are Schubertʼs symphonies before No. 7 evaluated?”

Franz Schubertʼs symphonies before No. 7 are evaluated as his early symphonies, particularly among musicologists and classical music enthusiasts. These symphonies are considered important works that demonstrate Schubertʼs musical growth and stylistic development. Below is an explanation of the major symphonies before No. 7 and their evaluation.

Symphony No. 1 in D major, D 82

Symphony No. 2 in B-flat major, D 125

Symphony No. 3 in D major, D 200

Symphony No. 4 in C minor, D 417 “Tragic”

Symphony No. 5 in B-flat major, D 485

Symphony No. 6 in C major, D 589

Overall Evaluation

Schubertʼs symphonies before No. 7 are crucial for understanding his early works and musical development. These works show Schubertʼs journey from classical styles to establishing his unique musical style. His early symphonies are highly regarded for their melodic beauty and emotional expression and are still performed today. They serve as valuable resources for understanding the complete picture of Schubertʼs work.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "I feel that some of Schubertʼs symphonies show influences from Beethoven. What do you think?"

Many parts of Schubertʼs symphonies reflect influences from Beethoven. Schubert, being a contemporary of Beethoven and active in Vienna, was significantly influenced by Beethovenʼs music. Below is a detailed explanation of Beethovenʼs influence on Schubertʼs symphonies.

  1. Symphony No. 4 in C minor, D 417 “Tragic”
  1. Symphony No. 5 in B-flat major, D 485
  1. Symphony No. 8 in B minor, D 759 “Unfinished”
  1. Symphony No. 9 in C major, D 944 “The Great”

Specific Elements of Beethovenʼs Influence

Conclusion

Schubertʼs symphonies clearly reflect influences from Beethoven. While incorporating Beethovenʼs techniques and expressions, Schubert developed his unique style. Beethovenʼs influence is an important element in understanding the depth and richness of Schubertʼs symphonies.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "In Schubertʼs symphonies, does the third movement show stronger influences from Haydn, Mozart, or Beethoven?"

The third movement of Schubertʼs symphonies (usually a minuet or scherzo) is influenced by both Haydn and Mozart, as well as Beethoven, but the degree of influence and specific style varies with each symphony. Below is a detailed explanation of how Schubertʼs symphony third movements are influenced by these composers.

Influence of Haydn and Mozart

Influence of Beethoven

Specific Examples of Schubertʼs Symphony Third Movements

Conclusion

The third movements of Schubertʼs symphonies show stronger influences from Haydn and Mozart in some works and from Beethoven in others. In his early symphonies, Schubert incorporated the classical minuet form, with a clear influence from Haydn and Mozart. In his later symphonies, he adopted the scherzo form, with a stronger influence from Beethoven. Therefore, Schubertʼs symphony third movements developed his unique style and expression while being influenced by both.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "Is there absolutely no remaining part of the third movement and beyond in the ʼUnfinishedʼ Symphony?"

Franz Schubertʼs Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished” has two completed movements and one unfinished sketch, but no complete score exists for the third movement and beyond.

Remaining Materials

  1. First Movement: Allegro moderato - Completed.
  2. Second Movement: Andante con moto - Completed.
  3. Third Movement: Scherzo - Unfinished. Schubert wrote up to the ninth measure of this movement, but the orchestration is incomplete. The sketch of this scherzo suggests that he intended to continue this symphony.
  4. Fourth Movement and Beyond - No complete sketches or scores exist.

Unfinished Sketch of the Third Movement

The sketch of Schubertʼs third movement indicates that he intended to continue the symphony, but there are several hypotheses as to why he left it unfinished. His deteriorating health and transition to other projects are considered possible reasons.

Attempts at Completion

Several composers and musicologists have attempted to complete Schubertʼs “Unfinished Symphony,” but due to the limited original material, these completions are largely speculative. Here is one example:

Conclusion

While no complete score exists for the third movement and beyond of Schubertʼs Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished,” an unfinished sketch of the third movement does exist. This suggests that Schubert intended to continue the symphony. Although there are attempts at completion, these are speculative due to the limited original material.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "Was Schubertʼs Symphony ʼThe Greatʼ discovered in a complete form? If so, why wasnʼt it published or performed during his lifetime?"

Franz Schubertʼs Symphony No. 9 “The Great” (in C major, D 944) was discovered in a complete form after his death. Below is an explanation of the discovery process and why it was not published or performed during Schubertʼs lifetime.

Discovery Process

  1. Discoverer: In 1838, Robert Schumann discovered the complete manuscript of this symphony when he visited Schubertʼs brother Ferdinand.
  2. Premiere: Schumann introduced the symphony to Felix Mendelssohn, who premiered it with the Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra on March 21, 1839.

Reasons for Not Being Published or Performed

  1. Scale and Difficulty:
    • This symphony is very large in scale and requires advanced technical skills for performance. Its length and complexity may have been seen as unsuitable for the standard concert programs of the time.
    • The orchestration is also large, which may have been a burden for the typical orchestras of the time.
  2. Publication of the Score:
    • This symphony was not published during Schubertʼs lifetime. The lack of publication reduced the opportunity for the work to become widely known.
    • Without publication, it was difficult for conductors and performers to access the symphony, contributing to its lack of performance.
  3. Schubertʼs Reputation:
    • During his lifetime, Schubert was primarily known as a Lied composer, and his symphonies and other large-scale works were not highly regarded. As a result, his symphonies were rarely featured in concerts.
  4. Economic Issues:
    • Schubert was in a financially difficult situation, with limited resources to promote large-scale works. This reduced the opportunities for his symphonies to be widely performed.

Conclusion

Schubertʼs Symphony No. 9 “The Great” was discovered in a complete form, but it was not performed during his lifetime. The main reasons include the scale and difficulty of the work, the lack of publication, issues with Schubertʼs reputation, and economic constraints. After Schubertʼs death, the discovery and premiere of this symphony elevated his reputation as a symphony composer, and today it is widely performed as an important part of the repertoire.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "Was the name ʼThe Greatʼ written on the autograph score?"

The name “The Great” for Schubertʼs Symphony No. 9 was not given by Schubert himself but was assigned by later musicologists and performers. Below is an explanation of the background.

Autograph Score and the Name “The Great”

  1. Notation on the Autograph Score:
    • Schubertʼs autograph score is inscribed with “Große Sinfonie in C,” meaning “Great Symphony in C major.”
    • This term “Great” was used to distinguish it from Schubertʼs Symphony No. 6 (also in C major), indicating that it was a larger and more grandiose work within the same key.
  2. Origin of the Name “The Great”:
    • The name “The Great” came into use as Schubertʼs works were re-evaluated after his death.
    • Particularly, when this symphony was discovered and premiered by Robert Schumann and Felix Mendelssohn, Schumannʼs praise for its musical value and scale influenced the use of the term “Great Symphony.”

Conclusion

The name “The Great” was not given by Schubert himself, and his autograph score was inscribed with “Great Symphony in C major.” This designation was assigned by later musicologists and performers who evaluated the scale and significance of his work. Today, this symphony is widely known as “The Great” due to its grandeur and musical value.



I asked ChatGPT4o: "Is the later numbering of ʼThe Greatʼ compared to ʼUnfinishedʼ because it was started later, or because it was completed after ʼUnfinishedʼ was abandoned?"

The reason Franz Schubertʼs Symphony No. 9 “The Great” (in C major, D 944) is numbered after Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished” (in B minor, D 759) is due to the following factors.

Composition Period

  1. Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished”:
    • Composition year: 1822
    • Schubert completed only two movements of this symphony. A sketch of the third movement exists, but it is not fully orchestrated.
  2. Symphony No. 9 “The Great”:
    • Composition year: 1825 - 1826
    • This symphony was composed in complete form and is positioned as one of Schubertʼs later works, significant in terms of scale and expressiveness.

Numbering Method

Conclusion

The later numbering of Symphony No. 9 “The Great” compared to Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished” is primarily based on the period of composition and completeness. Symphony No. 8 “Unfinished” was started in 1822, but only two movements were completed, leading to its numbering. Symphony No. 9 “The Great” was composed later and completed between 1825 and 1826, resulting in its later numbering.

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Created: 2024-12-13 13:38   Edited: 2025-04-11